Final Vision Plan for LUNC to $1+

[arunadaybasu]

@JESUSisLORD @godoal

That’s not what I am showing you.

I am showing you that there are absolutely no transfers. It doesn’t work like that.

The coins are already there. The coins were ALWAYS there.

How do I explain Cosmos and a blockchain to you even if I record an audio clip right now to explain it?

@fragwuerdig if you can check this and reply here and tell us what exactly is happening then it would be highly appreciated.

If there was anything sent from CP to these funded accounts of TR and L1 Team then it would show here. There is absolutely nothing.

You can ask TR and L1 Team whether they got anything or the balance just showed up after the prop passed. You will get to know.

Also, the calculation I shared before this is absolutely correct. You can ask the L1 developers and show me their reply to it.

The ONLY way to keep minting at a minimum is:

1. 50-50 Antehandler
2. Less than 0.1% gas

This is how all Cosmos chains are supposed to be designed.

If you don’t believe me, I will be right here after 3 months also since I am right here after this comment:

@arunadaybasu

Coming to current price of LUNC - well, if you search my comments you will find one in which it is stated that LUNC will never cross 0.0002 like this.

And this one:

@arunadaybasu

The fact is LUNC will never cross 0.0002 cause the community will not let that happen. No one invests in a chain completely divided by opinions and personal misgivings.

You have to understand I have absolutely no issues if you add two more zeros.

I am a developer so it’s easier for me to build dApps if the price of a crypto is low. And the gas fees are low. We are paying fees like 79 LUNC while transacting. And that too you guys are ensuring that we reduce the price per LUNC even further. What issues would I have?

I have publicly supported this prop, in this thread, and on Twitter as well. I am completely for it, whatever you guys wanna do

[JESUSisLORD]

@arunadaybasu here is the CP, you linked another address which is not the CP:

I did lookup to see if I could see the payment from the CP to TR in prop #11479 for 305,385,865. I didn’t see the incoming transaction but the wallet is fairly new and you can see the amount was withdrawn. So the CP funding transaction didn’t show up on finder? The payouts from the CP don’t show up on finder as transactions? Terra Finder.

[arunadaybasu]

For that I have to explain to you how does Cosmos work and how are blockchains on Cosmos instantiated using the genesis.json file.

The supply is already written over there in that file when you initialize the blockchain. This is called the TOTAL Supply.

Now, the account which created this blockchain is called the “zero address” and a burn is basically sending back the coins issued by this account TO THIS ACCOUNT. This is WHAT A BURN IS.

There are NO coins which are destroyed. That happens with tokens, NOT coins. Terra Luna Classic is a COIN, NOT a TOKEN.

There is in fact, nothing technically called “burning” on any blockchain on Cosmos.

Cosmos works by “allotting” coins from that admin account which created the blockchain. This is called “minting” though, as you can understand, technically speaking, there is nothing called minting also. It’s an allotment of coins.

Now, the price of a coin is calculated by the Market Cap / CIRCULATING Supply.

What is the Circulating Supply?

It is Circulating Supply = Total Supply - CP - OP- Zero Address (which created the blockchain)

Which is why, when you send the coins back to this account its a “buy back” which causes the supply to be cut.

This is, technically speaking, a re-allotment. The coins are NOT destroyed. It goes back to that same account and exchanges do not consider that in their calculations.

That’s all that is happening. Allotment and re-allotment.

When you are “transferring” coins between two wallets it is called a P2P transaction BETWEEN two wallets.

This has absolutely nothing to do with burning or the zero address.

What you are doing at the end of it is telling this zero address to allot coins to the OP and CP by using the ante-handler as a “tracker.”

That’s why you do not see any transfers there. Cause there was never any transfer. It’s an allotment of coins from the zero address. That’s all. You just increased the supply. It will show up on the exchanges the moment the rewards are withdrawn after 21 days.

This is how a Cosmos blockchain operates.

You guys are getting confused cause all of the above is happening at the same time and the figures you are looking at is superficial. MsgSend is not an indicator of what the system does internally.

It does not mint exactly 90-10 if you know how the ante-handler operates. It does what it wishes to do because it depends on a lotta things apart from that parameter. Ed had explained this to @godoal also. Ask him.

Why do you think it does that? If you answered this question yourself, you will get to know the entire system properly.

[fragwuerdig]

@JESUSisLORD @arunadaybasu: I would not expect that transactions from the community pool to normal user accounts would show in finder as normal transactions. The transfer of this money happens because a passed governance proposal going into effect. The Comsos SDK handles the transfer to the payout wallets on the L1 code by directly manipulating the state of the store/state (and not by sending L2 messages like for example MsgSend to itself).

[arunadaybasu]

Exactly. In simple terms, you are changing the balance by “re-allocating” the coins from the CP. Is that correct?

Also, am I correct about what I wrote in the previous comment(s) about burning? Is it a re-allotment of coins to the zero address (and the CP+OP)?

Cause I am absolutely sure ~250,000-300,000 USTC was minted (or rather, allocated) to the CP a few days back. That means, the moment that is taken out, bo(o)m, it adds to the supply! Is that correct? Obviously, we are not withdrawing the entire thing, but I am just saying, the moment we do…b(o)om!

Would really appreciate your answer to clear our doubts here.

I could be wrong (and I have absolutely no issues being wrong) but at least we will get to know what is correct. This is at least what I have read and understood from the Cosmos documentation tbh.

[godoal]

I think the issue is the definition of “mint” as seen from the chain mechanics or the user endpoint. Most in here refer to mint from the user perspective as-in bringing more coins into circulation as it happened when the seigniorage parameter was in effect.

@fragwuerdig

(and not by sending L2 messages like for example MsgSend to itself)

Ergo, L2 applications (dApps) make use of Msg* type transactions. The L1 module that applies the tax on L2 transaction messages is intercepted by the Ante Handler (L1) and splits them based on the specified parameter (10/90) allocating them into their relevant pools. You can monitor the byproduct of the split into the CP but not so easy in the burn address

@arunadaybasu

Cause I am absolutely sure ~250,000-300,000 USTC was minted (or rather, allocated) to the CP a few days back.

On 25th March (ish) there was a huge transfer off-chain that caused a USTC mint, didn’t have the time to track the transaction to tell more. On 9th April (ish) the L1 returned part of the unused funds in the CP bumping up the CP

[arunadaybasu]

@godoal

On 25th March (ish) there was a huge transfer off-chain that caused a USTC mint, didn’t have the time to track the transaction to tell more. On 9th April (ish) the L1 returned part of the unused funds in the CP bumping up the CP

I was about to put my prop for a vote 7-8 days back when I posted it here on Agora.

I checked the balance of UST in the pool as 3,313,000 and right now, you can see what is the balance.

This has obviously been minted.

L1 took their payment as LUNC and sent it back as LUNC I am assuming.

This is their wallet:

https://finder.terrarebels.net/classic/address/terra1mk7qfn9u6qn2afeytlsruk7ew8emxst3cw0c5f

Ahh, so there is a LUNC and a USTC transaction:

How is this matching though?

[arunadaybasu]

Hold on hold on hold on.

@godoal @Asobs @reXx do you know what we are looking at?

https://finder.terrarebels.net/classic/address/terra1mk7qfn9u6qn2afeytlsruk7ew8emxst3cw0c5f

https://finder.terrarebels.net/classic/tx/EF9CAD11F74B165D9F7909D66EB866C530B823AC1980261A279F25A44FAADBCB

https://finder.terrarebels.net/classic/tx/0BC49FD6C98F93B8D23BAA0646DD0B439E4551B57D45DE5047F90E3B642DFE47

What account is this? Is this an internal account or an exchange account?

https://finder.terrarebels.net/columbus-5/address/terra1jv65s3grqf6v6jl3dp4t6c9t9rk99cd8pm7utl

I checked on the terra money finder also just to be sure that I am not looking at a glitch:

https://finder.terra.money/columbus-5/address/terra1jv65s3grqf6v6jl3dp4t6c9t9rk99cd8pm7utl

Where is this money going to? Can you find out?

Cause this looks like the community pool, I mean THIS IS the community pool:

Soooooooo… what is the previous account? Just check it once.

Or is this the Community Pool but different account? Or am I mistyping or seeing something wrong?

Cause I clicked on the account address given here:

Rebel Station

It took me to this account:

https://finder.terrarebels.net/classic/address/terra1mk7qfn9u6qn2afeytlsruk7ew8emxst3cw0c5f

And in this account, I can see the transactions I just showed you in the beginning. And it’s clearly mentioned in the logs it’s a transfer of coins and it’s going to that account:

And that account seems to have Osmosis, Atom and SCRT tokens in it. Our Community Pool has Osmosis tokens in it?

And who informed you that the L1 Team sent the money back to the pool? I didn’t see LBA say that anywhere. On Twitter?

[JESUSisLORD]

@arunadaybasu

And who informed you that the L1 Team sent the money back to the pool? I didn’t see LBA say that anywhere. On Twitter?

See here this is the wallet that received the CP funds from the latest L1 Prop. You can see two transactions MsgFundCommunityPool transactions returning funds Terra Finder. Yes @LuncBurnArmy announced that on Twitter: https://twitter.com/luncburnarmy/status/1645920333332090880.

@Evgen the whole point of my plan is to achieve off-chain 1.2% burn tax. If we succeed it will be daily billion + LUNC burns, not tiny burns.

[Evgen]

@JESUSisLORD

No burns are not useless burning reduces the hyperinflated LUNC supply and is mandatory for us to get to $1. My plan and Redline’s does not contradict he can keep working on USTC re-peg while we burn LUNC.

Open charts, men. No one is interested more in these tiny LUNC burns, as like additional taxes from the Drifter. Dont forget that distribution is also active. The only way to survive. 1. Stop USTC distribution. 2. Start buyback USTC with all taxes. 3. Start returning the dapps.. We have 1,5 years max.

[arunadaybasu]

The money didn’t go to the Community Pool.

Did it @godoal ? hehehehe

I could be absolutely wrong, but… I don’t think that’s the CP.

[Kryptobia]

Just put it up for voting already so we can shut down this burntax nonsense once and for all

[arunadaybasu]

Yes it’s not. That’s not the CP. I checked. It has been done via some method in the code. I can see the code but I cannot understand it. It looks like there is a validator addresses there through which this transaction is being routed.

Even if I am to believe that this is actually going to CP, how to even check that?

And how do you even check what is being minted in the CP?

Cause the minting has nothing to do with the sending money there. Those are two separate functions.

[wagnerdalcin]

@arunadaybasu

And that account seems to have Osmosis, Atom and SCRT tokens in it. Our Community Pool has Osmosis tokens in it?

I think this thread might answer your question

[Proposal] Exclude IBC Assets from Taxation

Current Situation When I made the proposals about IBC reactivation to CosmosHub I had in mind to bring off-chain assets to Terra Classic so they could be traded against LUNC in a decentralized fashion - increasing the on-chain volume and therefore speeding up the burns while being independent from CEXs burning LUNC for us. The first thing I did after connection to CosmosHub was reestablished, was to transfer my ATOM to Terra Classic. I wanted to deploy it in a USTC/ATOM liquidity pool on Classi…

[Vendrugo]

@arunadaybasu

This is Cremation Coin’s account:

Terra Finder

kucoin deposit account

[godoal]

@arunadaybasu,

You need to check that diagram on a big screen, then everything will start making sense. There’s nothing wrong with that screenshot you have pasted. See details below:

The funds were returned by the L1 team to the CP on the day mentioned in the diagram above.

That address (terra1jv65s3grqf6v6jl3dp4t6c9t9rk99cd8pm7utl) is the distribution module where the CP lives and is NOT only used for CP distributions.

I hope this helps.

[arunadaybasu]

Yes you are right. The transfer did happen. My timezone is 1 day ahead of the transfer time in GMT. I am in GMT +5.30 hrs. The transfer happened at GMT -4 hrs.

The Finder is showing me the correct time in my timezone. Graph is showing GMT time I think.

Let’s consider that the transfer did happen and I concede to it that it did happen.

But what is happening is what we were talking about. That coins are getting minted.

@JESUSisLORD is saying coins are not getting minted.

And I am saying they are getting minted. And in your graph also it is clear it is getting minted.

At 0.2% most probably. So are they getting minted or not minted?

[godoal]

There is a nominal mint on a daily basis which can be seen in the circulation supply increasing. That will stop altogether once the chain ceiling (Total Supply) comes down enough (using burns) and finally meets that Circulating Supply.

[wagnerdalcin]

@arunadaybasu

@JESUSisLORD is saying coins are not getting minted.

And I am saying they are getting minted. And in your graph also it is clear it is getting minted.

Seigniorage was deprecated, so technically no minting is happening off the burn wallet; instead part of the tax income is being redirected to the CP due to the ante-handler logic.

So yeah, a share of on-chain taxes are being redirected to the CP without being technically “minted”. It’s all semantics here.

[arunadaybasu]

Yes so let’s get back to the discussion now.

What I was saying is that this is the current graph:

So, what I am trying to saying is that:

What do you think will happen to this graph if we now increase the gas fees by 6 times?

I think the answer is clear. Let’s forget the semantics for some time.

There are coins in the CP. And that is increasing which will be taken out at some point of time. So every time we take out anything from the CP or OP we take a hit.

And it’s bound to happen. Cause you are first decreasing the supply (by sending to CP+OP) and then you are increasing the supply (by taking out of the CP+OP).

In the meantime, you have burnt the market cap.

The solution is either:
A. Stop Burning
B. Stop Minting

Which one do you prefer? This is the question now.

Let’s stop beating around the bush and get to the point.