Keep in mind that without Vegas we wouldn’t be here and Alex would be just a name
4 Likes
@413x_45h4w @Vegas @ek826 I believe that people have faith in all of you. Requesting you to workout together and come up with 1 proposal. Involving masses for every single things is not a right idea. Because at the end of tunnel there is a light which you can see out of your experience matters the most. Fund needs to pay devs/infrastructure that is the real problem. Till today no one has put the proposal to pay devs from the community pool that is also a fact. How can we solve this with one single proposal and fast-track all the upgrade activity of the blockchain?. It’s my sincere request to all of you to think it thoroughly. Community will vote on either things and again in future war will start. This war will never end because the mission all of you have is the toughest one. War is the biggest hurdle. Take decisions the way we can move forward. Thanks to all of you for your time and efforts. If you fail at times it does not matter.
1 Like
An excellent idea, thank you Vegas.
Converting the off-chain assets to LUNC will create buy pressure, fund a war-chest to pay developers and support utility building projects without centralizing power in an unelected committee. Combined with the Terra Grants system, we now have an elegant solution for integrating off-chain assets for the benefit of the community.
Well done!
5 Likes
Whatever 
I am all for this proposal which is the best alternative to Alex’s prop. Here is a summary why:
- Those are community funds and should go to community pool
- Alex’s secret discussions with do kwon are suspicious and should be looked at warily
- The optics of this are bad. If you take the money and give it to individuals it looks like do kwon is funding TR and is in control of lunc again through Alex and his cronies
- It should be multiple proposals and every single member must be voted on if there is to be a steering group
- community does not trust Alex and some of the members he put on there
- Validators should NOT be allowed to hold dual roles as filters and voters of the proposals as it is a conflict of interest.
- This is a duplicate of ed’s proposal and unnecessary.
- this is against decentralization by concentrating the power of picking and rejecting a proposal among a few
- Proposals must not be co-signed anymore, but by a sole author/organisation to prevent hijacking of goodwill towards certain individuals
- TR devs must no longer try to influence votes by stating if they will or will not vote for a particular proposal. An article listing their thoughts on pros and cons is still acceptable, but they must cease influencing votes by ending with a line on whether they are voting yes or no.
9 Likes
i spoke with DK before of him. in terms of Alex receiving any kind of compensation, i don’t oppose
Lucid proposal that makes absolute sense
Bravo
3 Likes
Can we run a billion dollar business without a Management team involving a CEO and CFO? Let’s get the persons who want leadership roles to present their CV and let the community elect who they want. The management team should be tasked with the responsibility of running the daily activities of the community and chart our way with the approval of the community. Stop bitching among ourselves and start to work together. Pay the DEVS as soon as possible. Anyone who is receiving payment must be contributing significantly to the DEV of the community. We dont need to pay money just for “signing”.
1 Like
Of course I support this proposal coming from the only dude who really cares about the the spirt of luna classic, that’s the community.
This self elected 9 committee should not get any money from that found.
They can have all the preference they want. Its still fund belongning to the lunc community and should be spent as per the governance.
2 Likes
Adding to the discussion - there is already a senate or director’s board or whatever you call it. People safeguarding the chain from bad actors and supposed to vote in its best Interest. In the case of lack of public interest in proposals, they are supposed to lead the way.
These are called Validators. They have an elevated position in the governance process and should be well capable of allocating funds to projects. I’m sure there is a lot of new blood willing to do just that amongst them like Classsy, HCC or CryptoKings all brand new Validators as well as some veterans like orion money and allnodes who will definitely know how to handle such money.
So, I lost my money. An investigator found it. Can the investigator demand how much should be paid for the service? Hell no! Alex et al then found another reserve of cash and the saga continues. We are looking like misfits in managing the affairs of our business. We need elected management to handle the daily activities of the community, not just about this $ 4.6M. The feud over money is now tearing the community apart.
2 Likes
Gentlemen. The compromise here is fairly easy.
- Agree to secure the funds.
- Put 9 signers agreed on BY THE COMMUNITY in place to be on this Multi-Sig wallet.
- Designate the funds in the Multi-Sig wallet to be used to pay for DEVELOPMENT ONLY.
- Create a process by which a Scope of Work (SOW) is created and Requests for Proposals (RFPs) to do the work are submitted and evaluated by the 9 signers on the Multi-Sig wallet.
- The Devs with the best RFP (NOT the least expensive) that covers the SOW that has been spec’d out are awarded the contract for Development.
- The funds are paid out to the Devs based upon Benchmarks set up in the SOW. Meaning once X functionality is achieved then X dollars are paid out. This continues until the work is done.
As new needs and projects come up, it is rinse and repeat.
Should a “change order” come up, the 9 Signers would review the “change” and vote to approve/disapprove.
No funds move without SOW, RFP, a Contract, Guarantee of Payment, Goals being Met.
This is Business 101 and make no mistake about it. The Luna Classic Blockchain is a BUSINESS.
Lastly, this is as “Decentralized” as we will ever get and still accomplish anything. The 9 signers are selected by the Community. Those 9 signers are Trusted Members with one goal in mind: The success of the Blockchain and doing what needs to be done to insure we get to where we need to go.
“Pure Decentralization” will never work. We must have Goals. We must have a Plan. We must have Leadership to keep us on task.
This is the only way.
Now let’s stop talking about this and ACTUALLY GET SOMETHING DONE!
6 Likes
We need development plans more than we need plans that throw money at problems… So far, all I see are plans to make plans… expensive plan planning. Just follow this and save yourselves the troubles - if you can code it:
1 Like
If this compromise does not involve $5000 usd shadow salary then i would be agreeable on this. Is there anything that stops us from sending this money to the Community Pool while setting up such a decentraly voted board as you suggested? @ek826 argued that the time is of essence here, so we could send those funds to the Commnunity Pool while a the same time electing these people right? I dont see why sending these funds back to the pool is such a big problematic delay? We did not have the control over those funds for months so whats the rush now? Also why do we not have time to vet candidates and let community vote on each of them? We should not be forced to accept a personell package chosen by Alex Forshaw (very unpopular figure due to his record in TR) and accepting it here and now without changes.
1 Like
Price drop to 0.00021…
People lost the trust
Use 4.1M to buy back LUNC then send to burn address…
I hope…
2 Likes
First Alex, tell the community the 5k isnt simply to hold the sig key wallet, i guess you are all developper and will menage/dev code the blockchain with that 5k and give progress and details on what it is spent on ? so this could at least remove the darn fud about ** darn they get 5k for holding a wallet ** thx in bringing some light on a revised proposal that make it a bit more clear on that side along many others side that need more light on.
Second i see the point of Vega but i see the point of others aswell. 25% could be sent into a dev wallet on a liquidity pools 50% USTC/ 50% Lunc or fully Lunc that could be used to pay more dev help on a milestone way handled through a grant scheme method, totaly decentralized run by Edward or whoever.
Third , 50% could be kept making baby in their current pools of the ETH blockchain and the monthly reward could be used to Burn lunc, refill the oracle pools or any others use.
Four, 25% is used for a external dev developpement usecase a bit more centralized i guess following a mix of the proposal alex stated of 8 or 9 DEV/CODER being paid 5k a month for the work in menaging / coding the blockchain in the roadmap decision without being annoyed by anyone but with still transparency so nobody abuse on this side.
This would allow multiple side of the blockchain being worked out, everyone working on the blockchain to be paid and we could finaly progress and see how both side the decentralised working versus the side a bit more centralised.
Hope this gave a few idea overall to get this right, so we stop fight eachothers.
Alex, your proposal does not clearly articulate that you are creating a dev fund. That would really help things, as I mentioned in my feedback on your proposal directly.
While I think this proposal could have been better written and reviewed by someone for English language clarity, it has primary virtue in the fact that existing governance should be leveraged to support proper distribution of funds for development or any other purpose. If we find it ineffective, we should deploy proper controls to make it more effective. This proposal lacks any further implementation or governance details.
Alex, yours could be simplified and improved with a few changes and you will win more support.
2 Likes
Someone explain to me exactly why is Alex going to receive a 5k a month salary? An individual that’s shown to be an untrustworthy, self interest chasing, unstable parasite that’s actively told people to sell Lunc in the past and praises Lunc enemies like GCR? Someone who’s already “left” Terra Rebels twice, the last time being not even a week ago and the immediately slithers his way back to make shady proposals. What I propose is for people to look into exactly how shady Alex is and how his every move until now has been an active disservice and borderline sabotage of the community’s efforts. Alex should be shunned and ridiculed, not payed a god damn salary.
5 Likes
@ek826 @Zaradar @413x_45h4w @Vegas @raider7019 @Rex1 @FatMan @DEMONMONKEY777
Summary
To Centralise or not to Centralise? I’ve been following the Terra Classic revival since May after the crash. The truth is, the revival has been centralised since the Terra Rebels stepped in. However within the Terra Rebels there are problems that are dragging the whole revival down the pan so to speak.
It’s become the Alex vs Vegas show.
So the off chain asset discovery has once again created friction within the community
Centralisation and Decentralisation both pose problems.
So here’s a simple solution for everyone
Proposal
To progress we must resolve our differences.
For the 9 self elected members.
We know
1: Ed Kim - Community trust level high
2: Tobias Andersen - Community trust level high
3: Alex Forshaw - Community trust level low
4: Coach Bruce - Community trust level intermediate only because of Twitter feeds… No doubt a highly intelligent individual (just needs 
comment banning especially if the community will have to pick up legal fees!)
5: PFC - Ian - Respected member of the LUNC community, I staked 27m LUNC at one point in time with him.
6: Setten - Unknown but read his Twitter pitch to the community, seems like a good guy
7: Max B - Highly respected within TR and has made significant positive contributions without any drama
8: Strathcole - Respected member of the community and has made positive contribution to Lunc
9: Jack Zampolin - Respected member of the Cosmos community
So there is absolutely no question about whether these 9 people are capable. They are…
Capability isn’t being questioned here
All 9 of these individuals from what I can see have multiple source of incomes. Time poor… so we need to ask is what are they bringing to the table?
Are we getting Value for Money, or should we look harder for full time non Twitter famous people?
So here’s what we should be asking.
1: How much time commitment are they putting in to the Terra Classic revival
2: Can they give a breakdown of the $5k/month they want to charge the LUNC community (off chain assets are the LUNC community assets)
It’s important for these 9 individuals to be honest with their time commitment
Once they have given a breakdown of the above the LUNC community can then make an informed decision as to whether they are worthy of the $5k/m
The question then is does the funds belong to the Off chain self elected members who have probably been ‘elected’ by Do Kwon to work on the UST(C) repegging solutions as that is where TFL and LFG are stuck in legal battles…
So see this for what it really is - Do Kwon’s attempt to make UST holders whole again with the most cost effective solution. Hiring a team capable of doing this, very biased towards him and his trusted representatives.
It’s not a bad thing… We just need to accept the truth is what it is.
Now the community pool is used for a whole range of things, hence the fear of the $4.16m going into the black hole where Do Kwon won’t be able to control the work being done. It could be used in both Layer 1 and Layer 2 projects and not really do much for his headache…
So now that we understand the motive for the 6 insisting that the money remains off chain.
Let’s strike a compromise
Divide the funds in to 50:50
The self elected 9 manage the 50% funds to bring L1 up to Luna 2.0 blockchain standards and repeg UST(C), become independent of TFL
50% goes in to the community pool for everyone else to access. Which means selling the off chain assets for LUNC.
Now here’s what I would suggest - distribute the 50% portion from the community pool once LUNC price gets to x2 of current price so it becomes the equivalent of $4.16m. So ring fence the LUNC purchased using these funds.
The $60k/year salaries need reviewing - if the 9 self elected members would accept $2.5k/m and agree to burn the $2.5k/m then it might appease the community.
However if they can justify their fees and hold an AMA to pitch to us what value they bring then I’ll accept the $5k per month but this will be $2.5k/m + $2.5k/m performance related bonus from hitting KPIs which the community will set.
I believe we need to move forward rather than watch Alex and Vegas fighting. It gets boring after awhile and the community lose out.
I can’t make 2 grown men see that their ways are wrong.
But I can make this proposal where both parties win. (I don’t mean Alex’s corner or Vegas’s corner)
After all life is about compromising and creating Win Win Wins…
Let’s go and make LUNC fly again!
2 Likes